When the I&B ministry issued a ban on the videos, what was your reaction?
Sapru: A friend of mine pointed out that first, ‘Kaanta Laga...’ became a hit and then the controversy began. We believe that as filmmakers, we should delete any visuals found objectionable by the Censor Board. But both our products-‘Kaanta Laga...’ and ‘Chadhti Jawani...’ were censored and were in the market. We haven’t done anything controversial. Our products were accepted by people.
Rao: It’s as angry as you get when your work flops. You can’t go around asking, “why have you rejected my work.” So if the I&B ministry thought our videos should be banned, they must have their reasons. We thought we were doing right, they probably didn’t agree. They were just doing their job.
Were you directly informed about the ban?
Rao:No, we had no idea and read about it like everyone else. Once we finish a video, it belongs to the music company. So they got the information and it was trickled down to us.
But the videos didn’t get banned due to the Censor Board clearance ...What if they had not been cleared?
Rao: See, if the videos had been banned, we would have ensured that we don’t make a product that could get banned in the future. Either way, we would have dealt and moved on.
Sapru: Nobody buys a controversy. People don’t spend Rs. 50 just like that. A music cassette is an expensive product line. The audience buys it because they like the product.
How important, according to you, is the video to a song?
Rao: The song is the most important element. 60 per cent of it is great music, 40 per cent of it is commensurate visuals.
Sapru: The song and the lyrics are the King. But if the song is good and the video bad, the album may not reach the kind of success it is capable of. A good video can take it there.
How do you feel when your critics label your videos obscene?
Rao:I would like to know exactly who these critics are, and what are their specific points.
Sapru: The Screen music charts since the past several weeks have been showing that DJ Doll is on No.1 and Chadti Jawani at No.2. People have liked the albums, so I don’t think that there are many critics among the audience.
How have your families reacted to the controversy?
Rao:Everyone is behaving as if we’ve committed a crime that we need to be ashamed of. These albums are big hits. Why should our families object?
Sapru: Our families are very happy. ‘Kaanta Laga...’ is the biggest hit of T-series and the biggest hit of the decade.
Why did you refuse to talk to the press when the controversy was on?
Sapru: We were out of the country.
But I contacted you during that time and you said you had taken a conscious decision to avoid questions.
Sapru: (Thinks) We were busy with the shoot and the location hunting. We came back and realised that we have to be friends with the media. We felt that if the media asks a question, we must answer. Also, I wanted to give our point of view through a detailed interview instead of giving just a quote.
Why do you think so many people have a problem with your videos?
Rao:(Sighs) I don’t know. I can’t figure it out. People, not just in the metros, even in small towns, are buying the albums. Rickshaw drivers are shelling out Rs.55 to buy the cassettes. We are not taking anyone by their hand or forcing them to buy. I suppose our success will silence the critics. But they do have a right to their opinion and we respect that.
Do you think your videos are vulgar?
Rao: (emphatically) No.
Sapru: We think it’s a work of art. We have given six No.1 hits in a row. It’s not easy.
Rao:It’s not a fluke success. Our thoughts are not copied or ripped off from a foreign video. But no one discusses that.
Doesn’t the flesh display in your videos contribute to the success of the albums?
Rao:If an audience responded only to flesh display, everything showing flesh would be a hit. By that argument, FTV (Fashion TV) should have been a rage. You have the most beautiful women in the world wearing skimpy clothes, you have films where people are stripping and doing everything possible. They should all be successful; why is it that they’re not?
Sapru: We work very hard on our videos. DJ Doll, for example, is a very planned product line. For the first time, a music video featured a female DJ. We even told our musicians to mix the song like a female DJ would have mixed it.
Rao:Even the female DJ’s name was so well thought out. We picked ‘Doll’, a name that is English and yet familiar to the Hindi-speaking audience.
What about the scenes where the model pulls down her shirt to get the stamp imprinted on her chest in ‘Kaanta Laga...’ and the girl grabbing her rear in ‘Chadti Jawani...’? Aren’t they deliberately put in for shock value?
Rao: You know what? They’re different. The visuals in our videos are so true to life that they shock. The scene where Shefali pulls down her shirt at the nightclub to get the entry stamp imprinted on her chest is inspired by life. When I was 16, my friend and I would go to the disco. And she used to do that to embarrass the guy who would imprint the stamp.
Sapru:There is nothing offensive about that shot in ‘Chadti Jawani...’. We are not showing girls running around in bikinis on the beach. So many videos show backsides of girls.
The three girls in CJ look very young. How old are they?
Rao:They’re all between 19-22... they’re not that young.
Sapru: They are all adults, don’t worry (Laughs).
What about the infamous skirt flying shot in the Aryan’s video ‘Dekha hai...’ where the model’s undergarment was visible?
Rao: It was a Marilyn Monroe shot. Everyone knows it was a straight take on the famous Monroe skirt-flying shot.
Reportedly the undergarment was not supposed to show in that shot. It was, in fact, a mistake but was finally retained. Comment.
Sapru: No, no it was a planned shot.
Rao:Nothing happens by accident in our videos. But it was supposed to look like it happened by accident in the video. How can it be a mistake? There were production fans lying underneath to make the skirt fly and the model was wearing such a short skirt.
Your videos have often been criticised for relegating women to mere sex kittens.
Rao: They’re not sex kittens at all! Shefali in ‘Kaanta Laga...’ is a girl with a whole damn load of attitude. Even the girls in ‘Ye Vaada...’ were exchanging the phones and making fun of the guys. No woman in our videos is a bimbette.
But the three girls in the ‘Ye Vaada...’ are wearing suggestive clothes, doing sexy moves and are wearing really loud make-up giving a strong sexual sign.
Rao:The make up was loud only to match with the pink costumes. The girls were sitting on exclusive Dalmatian spot sofas. Traditionally, these sofas are combined with hot pink colours.
Sapru:Even the girls in ‘Chadti Jawani...’ are not bimbettes. After the guy puts the crown on their head, they tie him up. Who wants to see a story of a woman who is not special? I think the women in our videos are special.
Rao: The women we feature are a little wicked. And yes, they are sexy. I think a woman looking sensuous is great. We are not showing women living below the poverty line in the videos. In ‘Kaanta Laga...’, we showed a rich kid going to a club, so she was dressed accordingly.
In ‘Chadti...’ there are overtly sexual shots like the girl wearing only a shirt bending down suggestively to pick up a mobile.
Rao: So what? Filmmakers from Raj Kapoor to Guru Dutt have made their heroines look sensuous. They all do it in their own way. This is just our style and we are not apologetic about it. It’s the norm of the industry. Who wants to see someone ugly on screen?
Why the unnecessary suggestive shot of the girl stripping in ‘Chadti...’ and why the scanty clothing?
Rao:There is no stripping. There’s no big deal about the scene where she’s taking off her shirt. Is this the first time in the history of Indian cinema that you’ve seen a girl’s shoulders with her taking off her clothes? I don’t agree that the women in my videos wear fewer clothes. Let’s take ‘Chadti Jawani...’ and go girl by girl (Gets the cassette cover and explains, pointing to each girl). She’s wearing a dress, this other girl a body suit and the tall one is wearing pants and a tube top with the biggest of wings.
Sapru:We don’t show indecent stuff like guys ogling at the girls or anything. Do our videos show rape or murder? No. We are showing dance and drama. All forms of dance, from ballet, to dandiya to lavni, have been sensuous..
How do you feel when your videos called kinky?
Sapru: If someone thinks our videos are kinky, damn good (Laughs).
Rao: You know what we’re doing? We’re letting people’s imagination work. Because there is nothing shown, nothing even done. Everyone’s imagination is running riot...much more than we intended (Laughs). More than kinky, our videos are edgy; they’re different. So, they disturb. But the larger audience that is not so judgmental, has lapped it up.
Sapru: The videos are about the possibilities of what could happen rather than what is. In ‘Kaanta...’ you don’t even see Shefali’s cleavage or legs. I can show you more explicit visuals on TV.
So you feel there is nothing offensive in the ‘Chadti...’ video?
Sapru: Not at all. The video is about three angels. It was a summer campaign aimed at the vacations. The video is mainly for kids. It is inspired by the story of Goldilocks and the Three Bears. It’s a fairytale.
Rao: To make somebody look interesting requires intelligence. And it’s not just taking people’s clothes off. The video has cool colours like blue, keeping the summer in mind. We got the wings made in Australia, by the same person who made the wings for the English film Michael starring John Travolta. We’ve put in a lot of effort.
To what extent do the lyrics influence the visuals?
Rao: To a great extent. See, the lyrics of both ‘Kaanta Laga...’ and ‘Chadti Jawani...’ were teasing. If it’s a sweet song, you get sweet visuals. If it’s a sexy song, you get the corresponding visuals. Sometimes one is overtly sexual, at other times tender. These are the various colours of life. There is no need for people to get so offended about it. We are not propounding something so subversive that it’s going to kill the fabric of society. It’s not that important. They should go get a life.
What forms your target audience?
Sapru: Women and children form a huge part of our audience. All our videos are extremely popular with the kids.
Rao:Shefali tells me that her biggest fan base is between the ages of 7-11. She tours the circuit, so she knows. I don’t think a child that young is judgmental.
Maybe the parents are?
Rao: I think the parents are definitely deciding what child sees and doesn’t. The children don’t land up at the concerts alone. They are obviously brought tere by the parents.
How come there has never been a male doing all the sexy stuff in your videos?
Rao: You think men are sexy? Women are far more interesting. You’ve got a hundred different ways of dressing them up. Imagine if I gave a guy wings. He’d look so sissy. You just can’t make men look interesting.
Sapru: But we have featured good-looking men in our videos. Arjun Rampal and Dino Morea did their first videos with us. We’ve featured Bikram Saluja and Jas Arora as well.
Rao: They just don’t make guys like that any more (Laughs).
The models in your videos are always unconventionally beautiful.
Rao: Yes, in ‘Chadti...’, for example we were looking for a girl who looked a little foreign, a little exotic and who was a good dancer. We found Nigar who can belly dance really well.
While your videos have been named obscene , it has shot its models to instant fame. What has the reaction been from the modelling fraternity?
Sapru: A whole lot of girls have approached us. They all want to be a part of our videos.
Rao: Right from day one, there have been models that don’t like doing bold stuff and a section that doesn’t mind. We completely respect that. And we clearly tell the girl what she’ll have to wear and what she’ll have to do. We cast the girl only if she’s comfortable doing them. Everyone in our videos comes from good families. It’s not like we’re conning these kids into doing something.
Has it happened that you’ve approached a model and she has chosen to opt out?
Rao: Yes, it’s happened a couple of times.
You (Radhika Rao) are reportedly very strict with your models?
Rao: I don’t know...
Am I?
Sapru: (Interrupts) See, it’s very important to observe strict discipline during the process of making a video. A certain look is to be achieved, the models have to be perfected in dance. After the video, the same models that complained are thankful to her. So yes, Radhika is firm. She is the firmest (Laughs).
Rao: Everybody goes crying to Vinay complaining about how rude I am. I think I am very forthright by nature. If someone is acting badly, I’ll say something like, “Don’t act like you are the backside of a bus.” But all that is done to ensure the quality of the video. Once the product is out, the audience is equally cruel and ruthless with us.
A lot of your success has been attributed to the fact that you’ve been lucky and have had the best of songs and remixes to work on. Comment.
Rao: Five years, lucky? You mean to see ‘Gabbar Mix...’, Ashaji, Pankaj Udhas were all luck? It’s like telling Raj Kapoor or Yashji: you had great songs in your film, and so you got lucky. We are not denying that they are great songs, but it has nothing to do with luck. It is a mark of extreme intelligence that for five years we’ve been smart enough to choose the right songs. We knew before Falguni became a star, that her songs were great. There were hundreds of remixes, but we chose what sounded good to us.
Sapru: Do you know that before our ‘Kaanta Laga...’ came out, there were already two ‘Kaanta Laga...’ remixes in the market? If it is indeed the song that determines the success, then why didn’t these two albums do well? Things don’t become successful, in our country at least, if you don’t work hard (Laughs).
Which are you favourite among the videos you’ve directed?
Rao: Whatever we are doing currently is what we like. What’s done is out of our heads and our system. But nobody’s letting it get out of our system.
You re now making your feature film debut with the Salman Khan-starrer Lucky...No Time For Love. Will you work on a video now or concentrate on the film?
Sapru: We’ll do one video before our film. And I hope it doesn’t rake up a controversy like ‘Kaanta Laga...’. I think we’d better take up a nice, romantic, ballad song (Laughs).
Rao: We’ll just do something that excites us, that activates our brain cells. We’ve not decided which song. But 99 per cent we’ll do a remix, unless we get a great original track.
Do you feel that remixes are unfair to the original classic songs ?
Sapru: No, I feel remixes are a salute to the original tracks. We only work on songs that excite us and there is such a dearth of good songs.
Rao: We don’t even how the original songs were picturised or what movie they are from. A lot of the songs that have been remixed didn’t do well at that time. But they are great tracks with fantastic lyrics and music. I wish we were there when they were there. We would have rocked the nation (Laughs).
The Central Govt. might start a special censor board for screening vulgarity in music videos etc. How do you feel about that?
Rao: If it is the law of the land, we will abide by it. We have no hassles. We are not against censorship.
Sapru: We are for censorship
You have won a lot of awards for your videos in the past. Now it looks like you are attracting controversy...
Sapru: There are no awards anymore. Channel V, Zee and Screen awards for music videos no longer exist. MTV Awards don’t consider remixes, I think.
Rao: We were nominated for the RAPA awards but they gave it to ‘Aika dajiba...’, the Marathi song.
Sapru:In fact I read a news item that said ‘Aika dajiba...’ defeats even ‘Kaanta laga...’(Laughs). It’s like a backhanded compliment.
How has life been after Universal?
Sapru: We are very emotional about Universal. I was Senior Vice President, A&R and marketing and Radhika was the Creative Director. Those were the five best years of our lives. We miss Universal a lot, but it was time we moved on.
Did you always want to direct films?
Rao: Definitely, but we got off to a late start because we took a detour.
Sapru:Ya, before Universal we had this company called Aquarius. We used to make ad films and corporate films.
Rao: I met Vinay when I was just a kid with 4,000 rupees in my bank. He told me to write a script for him and paid me 20,000 bucks! We became friends and then he asked me to join him as his partner.
Tell us more about your film?
Sapru: Lucky stars Salman Khan and Mithun Chakravarty. We are hunting for the heroine. We will be shooting this year, so the film should be completed, end of 2003 or early 2004. The music will be composed by Adnan Sami and we are really excited about that. It is co-produced by Super Cassettes. People are telling us that it’ll be interesting to see Mithun on screen after a long time. I hope the critics now don’t say that we cast Mithun to create a controversy (Laughs).
Rao: Or because we want to destroy the moral fabric of the society (Laughs).
Lastly, what do you want to tell those who oppose your videos?
Sapru: I think they should just ‘update’ their outlook (Laughs). They are criticising something that the audience has lapped up. Hits don’t happen unless the product is accepted by people.
Rao: And that we completely respect their opinion.
That’s a very diplomatic answer...
Rao: And we don’t give a damn (Laughs).